The Civil War II: North Frats vs. Southern Fraternities, Part 1 of 9
“Civil war? What does that mean? Is there any foreign war? Isn’t every war fought between men, between brothers?” – Victor Hugo
Being in a fraternity is like graduating from a state school, or writing a column on TFM: we like to think anyone actually gives a shit. I mean, we have some self-righteous notions about the superiority of Greek life, right? Chances are good that you’ll click down to the comments here and read some entreaty about the talent of the fraternity man and his ability to make lots of money (as if the first question any Fortune 500 CEO asks prospective employees is “Frat?”). And we have rosy outlooks about our house and our chapter. Our particular school, of course, means a lot to us as well. There’s something else, though — a strong undercurrent of division I’ve noticed ever since someone commented below one of my articles: “Why is a Northern Jew telling me anything?” That one went in the scrapbook, by the way, and to answer your question: because we have all the money and run all of your entertainment.
The South is better than the North, the North is better than the South, and on and on. It’s easy to understand; frat life on either side of the Mason Dixon is vastly different — almost incomparable if not for the simple fact that they proudly display Greek letters and homoerotically haze freshmen. So, let’s break this down once and for all. Which region of the country has the superior fraternity life? Is it the “racist half-wits” from the South? Or is it the “classless A-holes” from the North?
First, a few rules and notes: in the interest of fairness, I will be breaking this down in nine separate categories over the coming weeks, and attempting to find a winner in each individual category in order to avoid generalizations. For our purposes, the South will be anything below the traditional Mason Dixon, with a couple noted exceptions — I’m counting Maryland as a northern state because I think that’s basically how they feel about it (everyone from Potomac is nodding their head while eating Rosh Hashanah leftovers). Texas will be considered as its own country. Arizona, New Mexico, and Nevada will be counted as part of California, and California will not be counted at all. Sorry, California.
As for me, I’m as independent a party as you’ll find. Though I live in New York and attended Penn State, I’ve been to several schools and houses across the South and had the time of my life. Also, my school recently covered up kid-rape, so, you know, I don’t really have a horse in the race here. Nevertheless, I have a deep appreciation of fraternities and Greek life, so I’m attacking this with the anthropological passion of Jane Goodall, minus having sex with gorillas.
Our first category will be General Attitude. Let’s dive in:
General Attitude
A quick story: I went down to Georgia for a wedding and ended up playing golf with the groom’s party because I didn’t know many people there, and that southern hospitality ain’t no joke. I saw a huge old mansion just off the course and just offhandedly asked some dude if there are a lot of old plantation houses still around. His answer: “Not since your boy Sherman burned ’em all down.” As his buddies all nodded in agreement, I thought, “Who the fuck is Sherman?” Then some forgotten synapse fired to remind me that in 7th grade we spent half a Social Studies period talking about General Sherman burning the South in the Civil War before we moved on forever.
Not to trivialize the Civil War here, but I think we’re all in agreement that the general outcome was a positive one, so it’s fascinating to me that these guys still kind of viewed it as a “loss.” And there’s another phenomenon at work here: The Loser’s Lament. For example, Notre Dame football has probably never even thought about Navy except for the week of the game, but I can guarantee you Navy has a hard-on for Notre Dame the first day of training camp. The Tri-Lambs celebrated like crazy after winning the Greek Games, while the Alpha Betas felt pissed then moved on to climb a new sorority’s mountain of vaginas. So, whenever a northerner sees a bumper sticker that says, “The south will rise again,” he doesn’t proudly point to his “Remember how we won?” sticker. All he thinks is, “Isn’t that racist adorable?”
I truly believe that a disappointing loss in a war 150 years ago, regardless of the larger implications, still colors the history and attitude of the southern man, handed down generation after generation. But disappointment breeds care, and if there’s one thing a southerner does, it’s care. And identify. They find solace in their region and history and families, and it’s the reason the southeast is the only place you’ll ever hear a stadium full of people chant, not for their team, but for their league. It’s something no one from the North understands, and I have to say, that’s kind of a shame. The South cares more, and so it bleeds fraternity life a bit more, celebrates it more, talks about it more, makes cheesy, awful videos for recruitment more, and that’s something.
Then again, there’s an old expression in football and sex: “Act like you’ve been there before.” There is something just a touch desperate about it all. While we northerners tend to brush off the debates so we can keep fist pumping, the southerners take to the comment threads of TFM to plead their case about the southern man’s superiority. Sorry, guys, no one’s really listening but the choir.
Nevertheless, I suppose I’d rather have a chapter room full of people who care than a bunch of guys in lax pinnies who can’t get their noses out of the coke bowl long enough to put together a decent week-long. So, yeah, I’ll give this to the South, but maybe give the recruitment videos a rest, you fucking geeks.
General Attitude: The South wins over The North.
The North won the war. The south needs to realize that the reasons for fighting the civil war were stupid in the first place. Boohoo if slaver goes away I wont be able to make as much money, bunch of greedy racists who refuse to accept change. The south will never rise again. We have a black president, that should give you an idea of how badly the Confederacy did.
11 years ago at 12:15 pmHowever I do wish there was some southern hospitality here up north but that has nothing to do with the matter at hand.
11 years ago at 12:15 pmThe fact that your a politically correct pussy who didn’t want to seem racist by voting for the white guy has absolutely nothing to do with the Civil War. Try again
11 years ago at 4:22 pmClearly you’ve never entertained the idea of State’s Rights, nor would I expect a pro-big government jackass, like yourself, to understand it.
11 years ago at 10:07 pmCan we all agree that both the North and South are better than the West?
By that I mean California.
11 years ago at 12:19 pmI think that it’s generally understood that the West isn’t on the same level as North and South Greek life, but nonetheless need to be said in case there was any doubt.
11 years ago at 2:24 pmI honestly expected more of a ” ‘Fuck you!’ ‘No, fuck YOU!!’ ” to play out in the comments section. Gotta say I’m a tad disappointed.
11 years ago at 9:12 pmYes, thank you. This argument is stupid. Chances are unless you’re extremely uptight you probably honestly would be happy living in either the North or South. It’s more important that you find a nice, safe, wealthy city. If anybody from the North honestly thinks all of the South is dumb and poor: 1. They’re ignorant. 2. Brentwood TN, Buckhead GA, etc. Just like anybody from the South who believes all of the North wears hoodies and cargo shorts and fist pumps is ignorant as well. The important part is that everybody knows how shitty the west is. Namely california. Fucking disgrace to America. Little homos. In the words of the great Kenny Powers, “Fuck the west up the butthole, they get nothing”
11 years ago at 9:04 pm^ the few times I’ve ventured up North to visit some long lost family relatives, I’ve noticed that they all wear hoodies and cargo shorts. You got me on fist pump though… they don’t do that. But definitely hoodies and cargos.
11 years ago at 10:00 pmU of A greek life is far more superior
11 years ago at 7:10 pmI think that we can all agree that both the North and South are better than the West? Am I right?
By that I mean California.
11 years ago at 12:20 pmWe heard you the first time
11 years ago at 1:12 pmFuck your stupid name. HIMYM is so fucking gay.
11 years ago at 8:38 amThere is nothing racist about wanting to the south to win. The Civil War wasn’t about slavery, it was about states rights.
11 years ago at 12:20 pmYes. The States’ rights to own slaves. Let’s be honest, the Southern economy was based on slavery, and they didn’t want the North infringing on their economic prosperity.
11 years ago at 2:37 pmYes it was. Mainly about the states’ right to have slaves. Smaller states rights issues were about tariffs and such. Why else would they secede right after Lincoln’s election. He wasn’t overly in favor of any other pro-northern policy. He was born in Kentucky for Pete’s sake. Another case of revisionist history by people lacking critical thinking skills.
11 years ago at 2:41 pmclassic ignorant inbred. sorry ur great great poppy got his dick sawed off by a repeating rifle for nothing.
11 years ago at 3:07 pmActually, the whole war started over Tariffs. The North made the money of the sweat of labor in the south. The industrial revolution was making things expensive up north, Lincoln tried tax tariffs at triple what they were at the time. This caused SC to secede first and then the rest is history. Lincoln’s escape goat was slavery to get people to actually back the war….kind of sounds like Obama today huh? And if you look at the CSA constitution, it forbids the slave trade of any kind….something the North still did. Only 5% of the population owned slaves so I doubt those people were willing to die over a bunch of Africans.
11 years ago at 4:39 pm^
11 years ago at 5:34 pmrockytop1 is spot on. I’ll never forget one of my American History classes taught by an Ivy league Ph. D., when we got to the Civil War he asked those who thought the war was about slavery to raise their hands. He proceeded to say “anyone with their hands raised doesn’t know shit about the Civil War.” Simply look up Lincoln’s letters to various southern governors proposing the Corwin Amendment (the original 13th amendment). If the south was seceding because of slavery they would have gladly ratified the amendment and stayed in the Union. That being said slavery was an abomination and a large scar upon our great country. However, it does a disservice to the hundreds of thousands of American’s who died on both sides for the intricate history of the antebellum period and the Civil War to simply state it was because of slavery.
11 years ago at 10:21 pm^While I agree with what you said, it’s called a scapegoat, not an escape goat. God Bless the South
11 years ago at 11:33 pmSpot on rockytop1
11 years ago at 8:51 amI’ve always had a blast with our southern chapters, but damn am I glad that the North doesn’t have have high school “frat stars”.
11 years ago at 12:21 pmGive it some time, and the disease will spread. It’s kind of a “Dawn of the Dickheads” scenario unfolding.
11 years ago at 9:09 pmHave to agree coming out of Northeast NJ, the nice part, it started to hit my school with my graduating class.
11 years ago at 2:28 pmIt’s so fucking bad in Atlanta now, and I thought it couldn’t get much worse when I left 3 years ago.
11 years ago at 12:02 am^ agree. coming from the north atlanta suburbs, i definitely know what you mean. shit is bad
11 years ago at 1:24 pm^* and ^ Same. I am a recent Atlanta private school grad and when I was a senior the kids IN MIDDLE SCHOOL were trying to frat hard.
11 years ago at 10:42 pmI hate being lumped into the north, honestly. I’m from as far south as you can get and still be from the north (Indiana) and we kind of catch the shaft from southerners being called yankees and shit. I consider myself from the midwest which is kind of a hybrid. Northern in industry and culture, yet southern in agriculture and mannerisms. Keep us out of this.
11 years ago at 12:49 pmIt’s an uphill battle you’re fighting there. Hell, I was raised to consider anyone who lives north of Birmingham, Alabama to be a Yankee and generally annoying.
11 years ago at 2:02 pmThey’ve never droveeee thru inndianaaa
11 years ago at 2:06 pmFuck you Yankee.
11 years ago at 3:23 pmSame story for going to school in Ohio.
11 years ago at 2:48 pm^Agreed.
11 years ago at 11:46 am2,2,1
11 years ago at 12:51 pmMore like 1,2,1
11 years ago at 1:47 pmGood, don’t include California. We boast the world’s 9th largest economy, and are therefore too good to be grouped in with your shit bag states.
11 years ago at 12:58 pmBeing billions of dollars in debt. NF.
11 years ago at 1:08 pmgoing democrat in every presidential election after 1988. NF.
11 years ago at 2:01 pmFormer Democrat governor returns to office to kick some ass around and get California back in the black as the world’s ninth largest economy. TFM.
http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2013/06/the-fixer/309324/
11 years ago at 2:42 pmGod Save Dixie! It wasn’t the Civil War….it was the War of Northern Aggression.
11 years ago at 1:05 pmSometimes you gotta whoop a pledge into shape.
11 years ago at 1:56 pm^
11 years ago at 3:12 pmThe war between the states is also acceptable.
11 years ago at 3:26 pmFuck Sherman’s March. Even to this day, you can see the scars of the South from the destruction he caused. The Emancipation Proclamation may have gotten rid of the cheap labor, but we would have been get past that in 20-30 years. But burning down and pouring salt all over our crops is what caused the majority of the poverty we still see around today. You can’t easily recover when someone destroys the most important source of revenue that the South had.
11 years ago at 1:06 pmOh and I suppose Andersonville was the Disneyland of the era?
11 years ago at 1:18 pmThis comment is far underrated. It’s not like Sherman got a few thousand people in a stright line and had them ride horseback on roads and threaten people. He had damn near 70,000 Union Soldiers killing, pillaging, burning homes and farms, eating peoples animals and pouring insane amounts of salt into the land. People who have never seen what happens when copious amounts of salt enter a type of ground that aren’t meant to have salt in it, have no fucking clue what happens. The soil takes generations to fix and no amount of manure or replacement soil added will fix this issue.
Hats off to you, LEGENwaitforitDARY.
11 years ago at 1:32 pmGeorgia = the entire south?
11 years ago at 2:24 pmSherman and his army = The entire North?
11 years ago at 2:36 pm^ I said absolutely nothing about the North
11 years ago at 2:49 pm^^ It’s true that Sherman’s March only happened in Georgia, but he is the main representation of an action that happened in most states by different generals. Sherman’s March is the most memorable one since the road from Atlanta to Savannah was one of the wealthiest and most important to the Southern economy
It was war time. We dropped literal tons of nuclear radiation on Japan. Get over it.
11 years ago at 4:32 pmGreat comment. The sad thing is that many people growing up in the majority of southern cities have no clue about Sherman and the destruction he caused the state. We lose more memory of the past with every passing decade, in part due to public education and big city’s private.
11 years ago at 4:37 pm^^ End of discussion. Go big or go home pussies.
11 years ago at 4:47 pm^^^That’s the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard. First off, the nuclear bomb was dropped during the height of WW2, and was used so that we wouldn’t have to sacrifice more American lives than we already had in Europe and other regions of the Pacific. Sherman’s March on the hand was towards the end of the Civil War when the South was at certain defeat, and it had no sort of benefits for the Union apart from kicking the South in the balls when they were already down. Secondly, and most important, we were brothers fighting against brothers, not a foreign threat. The North literally rubbed salt on our gashing wounds. There was pure disdain in these actions, no military strategies.
11 years ago at 5:59 pmSo no, ‘It was war time’ is not an acceptable answer to the pain and suffering we still feel today
Were the horrors at the Andersonville POW camp acceptable because it was war time? Union POWs that survived came out of that camp looking like Auschwitz survivors. Confederates did some fucked up things, too. Don’t act like total victims. I’m not commending the ‘total war’ that Sherman brought, I’m just saying there were some really fucked up things going on at that time.
11 years ago at 7:04 pm^ I’ll be honest with you, I knew very little about Andersonville before you mentioned it, it was swiftly mentioned in my history class. I guess I’ve got public school education to thank for that. But from what I understand, yes, that was a horrible thing from our part, and it’s hard to take in that humans can do that to each other, especially Americans to other Americans. It only reinforces my second point in my response above: We were brothers fighting brothers. I’m not going to get too into what I believe should have been done instead of the Civil War since it’s not going to change the past, but Emancipation Proclamation should have been a gradual process, not the immediate action that was taken instead. Everyone would have somewhat benefited instead of a single region of the country winning it all, not to mention that 600,000+ lives wouldn’t have perished.
11 years ago at 8:57 pmGetting blacked out on Juneteenth. FaF
11 years ago at 12:22 amThis thread started off as a subtle “The North Sucks And Ruined Our Land” thread and slowly turned into a “Can’t We All Just Get Along” thread. NF
11 years ago at 2:09 pm